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F&o loss - confusion on how to show the loss

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07 August 2011 Hi,

I am trading only in F&O and made the losses for the last 2 years. Last year the tax consultant filed my return in ITR2 and this year another tax consultant filed by using ITR4. I would like to know few points related to Tax filling,

1. Should we need to consider the loss from F&O transactions will be considered as “Loss from business other than loss from speculative business” or Loss from speculative business”

2. I heard Business losses can be carried forward for 8 years and speculation loss can be carried forward for a period of 4 years only.

3. For the F&O transactions, which ITR (2 or 4) form we need use and how many years we can carry forward the losses.

4. Some people are telling F&O losses are needs to be treated as “short term capital loss”, hence ITR 2 has to be used. Some other people are telling anything Derivative transactions, it comes under “Loss from business”, hence ITR 4 has to be used.

5. Last year total loss is 8 lacs and should I need to submit my books of accounts to auditor to audit the same.

Request you to clarify me asap also if possible please give me your email id for further communications.

Thanks
K7
9945539219

07 August 2011 As per proviso (d) to secion 43(5) trading in F & O carried out through a recognized stock exchange is not a speculative transaction. Therefore, loss from F & O should be considered as 'normal business loss' for which ITR-4 has to be filed in the asessment year 2011-12. The said loss can be carried forward for eight years provided the return showing the loss has been filed on or before the due date for filing the return.

07 August 2011 Dear Chackrapani

Thanks for your reply. Would you please advice me whether i need to get my books of accounts to get audited in that case for 8 lacs loss.


07 August 2011 As u know audit is based on turnover. In F & O , turn over means the absolute value of profit and loss of the tranactions done in an year. So determine the turnover as i said ( 8 lacs loss alone can't determine) and decide upon audit u/s 44AB of the IT Act,1961.

07 August 2011 Sir,

Please correct me if i am wrong,

Total Buy Value is 10,358,724.50 and total Sell value 9,657,856.60.

Should i need to add both these values to arrive "absolute value of profit and loss of the tranactions done in an year"

If i add both the above values it comes around 20,016,581 (2 crores)

Does this mean i need to submit for audit.

If you don't mind i can send my excel sheet where i made all the transactions in F&O. Would you able to confirm this to me.

Thanks sir

07 August 2011 no,
absolute value means net profit or loss from transaction.

eg. A Company future pur @ 600 (100 share lot) and sale @ 650 than absolute turnover is 50*100 = 5000.

07 August 2011 Thanks Anoop sir.

I think you mean cross profit/loss. Am i right.

The total gross value is -700,867 (7 lacs)

But i added other charges from brokerage and showed total loss as 8+ lacs

07 August 2011 Yes, net of profit and loss and its also include transaction exp.


07 August 2011 Thanks Anoop sir.

Since my gross amount is around -7 lacs, i am assuming that there is no need to submit for audit.

Am i right.

Would it possible for you to quickly go through my excel sheet where i done the computation and advice me whatever i done is correct or not.

Please give me your email id, if you could able to help me here.

Thanks

Regards
K7

07 August 2011 ok, please send me and let me check.

and not need to take your accounts audited.

attach your excel with CCI mail.

07 August 2011 Anoop sir,

I don't think i can attach any file by using PM message. I did sent one PM message to you, but no facility of attachment

Kindly send me an test mail to my id kesavan100@yahoo.com

so that i can send the file

Thanks for your understanding

Regards
K7



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