Originally posted by : Jithin
	For example, ICAI can stipulate some basic conditions to be fulfilled by firms in order to qualify for the purpose of imparting training to articles. Maybe ICAI can set up a database of firms which they consider capable of giving good enough exposure to the articles and limit articleship to these firms. ICAI can change the current course structure and make it residential(1 year residential course for IPCC+2 years articleship+1 year residential course for Final+1 year compulsory Industrial training). A residential course will definitely help in improving the communication skills of the students as well as help in their overall personality develpoment. It will also ensure that the students get access to uniform,quality teaching. Making industrial training compulsory will give students a first-hand experience of working in an industry and that will help them immensely when they start searching for their first job.   P.S. Hope to see some positive changes in the revision proposed by ICAI in 2016.

ICAI should sign MOUs with IIMs, XLRI, FMS and other top management institutes to allow CA students to participate in inter B-School Finance Quizzes, Business Planning Competitions and other extra-curricular. Today Engineers, Doctors, B-School students have such platform to know where they stand in the crowd. A couple of GMCS sessions can never replace the learning which is done through the extra-curricular.

And yes, residential course is also a good idea.

My $0.02

Originally posted by : GAURAV KEWALRAMANI
	Mr Ganeshbabu k is that true that after completing articleship we can get 30-35k easily.do u have any solid proof?

You can even earn the same salary after your BCom or BBA. But your college brand, communication skills, domain knowledge, technical skills will come into the picture. You may even need a reference to get into a good firm or MNC. 

Similarly the case with CA Articles in Big 4 and other reputed mid sized firms. This is mostly possible in the case of metro cities.(MDCKBH)

Originally posted by : greatest
	ICAI should sign MOUs with IIMs, XLRI, FMS and other top management institutes to allow CA students to participate in inter B-School Finance Quizzes, Business Planning Competitions and other extra-curricular.

Thats a good suggestion but I amnt sure how far it can be implemented in the present set-up(it can surely be done if the course is made residential). Once u are into articleship, it will be a pretty arduous task getting leave for all these activities.

Originally posted by : CA Parul Saxena
	Mr. Ganeshbabu i think you are not aware about the reality. times are gone when CA final after their articleship used to earn very good salary. I have seen many candidates who are at home or after furstration ready to work in CA firm just for Rs.10-15k or less. CA course is interesting no doubt but if +ve results are not met after completing it then what is the use of it.... 1)Exploitation in articleship CAs use their articles as their servant for personal work. 2)After completing it in more than 3 attempts comapnies dont take interest in the candidate. 3)starting salary is very less except for rankholders. 4)There is value of rankholders only there is huge amount of discrimination.

hello parul mam,
i fully agree with ur views.
i am appearing for my second grp this time for 8th time with negligible hope to clear, rest upon amlighty and institute.

In my city i tried for a job as a ca inter guy, hardly anyone is willing to give more than 10-12 k and position for c.a firms are even worse- 3 to 4k :D

I tried a placement agency service, he told me to remove ca inter from my resume, and assured that by removing that i willl b able to get better offers.

That day i realized whats the worth of this course.

Originally posted by : greatest
	Originally posted by : Rubul And as pointed by greatest that most of the CA's lack communication skills thats why they are jobless or unemployed or underpaid (he has wrote many things but that is my interpretation of his comment in a nutshell, correct me if I am wrong). I disagree with that (not totally). Its enough for a CA if he understand/speak bussiness level communication in case of verbal english and as far as written english is concern, it has to be very good if not excellent.  No. My point was not on verbal ability or Business English. My concern is about "Domain Knowledge" and "Skill set". Engineers:-They are expected to know a lot more than what they learn in their colleges for the MNCs to give them a job. And the demand supply equation in the case of Engineers is much more than that of CAs. They acquire new skills by taking private classes. These skills include all the technical skills required for doing jobs and they may sometimes even include the communication skills. Medicine students:- Same is the case with the medicine students as even they are expected to much more than what they learn at an institute of medicine.(Even an MBBS student) MBA Students:- We underestimate these people assuming. -After clearing an MBA entrance, they do masti for 2 years and companies choose them for front end roles only for their communication skills.(Assumption) Reality:-I would suggest you to personally visit an IIM or an institute like FMS or XLRI.  These institutes have faculty who hold Phd. level degrees in their respective subjects and there will be no stress of getting failed in the exams. And the sole aim will be to gain knowledge and apply them in the case study and other places.  CA Students:-We only study for the examinations. The emphasis is neither on expertise nor on applying skills but on scoring high/ranks in the exam.  You have even said something like Dummy articleship, theoretical knowledge etc. The learning and exposure which we get at the articleship level is very low and you can't get a job in fields like Core Finance which are high paying when compared to a regular job in Transfer Pricing or Taxation. As these Core Finance jobs may need complete different skill sets.. The knowledge you get at articleship level is more clerical and less managerial. The Big 4 articles score better here as they have better exposure, but only if they try to make an effort to optimally utilize the resources around them. My opinion.

visiting XLRI OR IIM's wont help buddy, as one doesnt gets number in ISCA and flunks in exams, the expectations and curiousity of learning subject goes to hell.

What the hell they want from a subject like ISCA being introduced in C.A curriculum...

They want to give I.T enabled skill set to students, introduce SAP as a compulsory practical measure in course set. But no , they just want students to mug up stuff and write it as it is in exams.

Originally posted by : abhishek agarwal
	Originally posted by : greatest Originally posted by : Rubul And as pointed by greatest that most of the CA's lack communication skills thats why they are jobless or unemployed or underpaid (he has wrote many things but that is my interpretation of his comment in a nutshell, correct me if I am wrong). I disagree with that (not totally). Its enough for a CA if he understand/speak bussiness level communication in case of verbal english and as far as written english is concern, it has to be very good if not excellent.  No. My point was not on verbal ability or Business English. My concern is about "Domain Knowledge" and "Skill set". Engineers:-They are expected to know a lot more than what they learn in their colleges for the MNCs to give them a job. And the demand supply equation in the case of Engineers is much more than that of CAs. They acquire new skills by taking private classes. These skills include all the technical skills required for doing jobs and they may sometimes even include the communication skills. Medicine students:- Same is the case with the medicine students as even they are expected to much more than what they learn at an institute of medicine.(Even an MBBS student) MBA Students:- We underestimate these people assuming. -After clearing an MBA entrance, they do masti for 2 years and companies choose them for front end roles only for their communication skills.(Assumption) Reality:-I would suggest you to personally visit an IIM or an institute like FMS or XLRI.  These institutes have faculty who hold Phd. level degrees in their respective subjects and there will be no stress of getting failed in the exams. And the sole aim will be to gain knowledge and apply them in the case study and other places.  CA Students:-We only study for the examinations. The emphasis is neither on expertise nor on applying skills but on scoring high/ranks in the exam.  You have even said something like Dummy articleship, theoretical knowledge etc. The learning and exposure which we get at the articleship level is very low and you can't get a job in fields like Core Finance which are high paying when compared to a regular job in Transfer Pricing or Taxation. As these Core Finance jobs may need complete different skill sets.. The knowledge you get at articleship level is more clerical and less managerial. The Big 4 articles score better here as they have better exposure, but only if they try to make an effort to optimally utilize the resources around them. My opinion. visiting XLRI OR IIM's wont help buddy, as one doesnt gets number in ISCA and flunks in exams, the expectations and curiousity of learning subject goes to hell. What the hell they want from a subject like ISCA being introduced in C.A curriculum... They want to give I.T enabled skill set to students, introduce SAP as a compulsory practical measure in course set. But no , they just want students to mug up stuff and write it as it is in exams.

Abishek you have spoken only truth and truth my Friend.

Guys,

The reason for the cources failure is we ourselves...how many students want to learn...nobody...all just want to get the degree...also presenting your own self is important...in my GMCS batch a girl started crying when she was called onstage....when you talk with your fellow students it is saddening to see many donot know what is happening in the global market...It is always easy to blame others...remember CA is not the destination..CA is the means to reach it...their are many people who are great but they didnt have their fancy qualification.....we need to understand what are out positive qualities and channel them...brooding and giving all hopes is a sign of a looser...Jitne ke liye ichcha lagti hai :)

best of luck folks and hope should be eternal :)

Originally posted by : abhishek agarwal
	visiting XLRI OR IIM's wont help buddy, as one doesnt gets number in ISCA and flunks in exams, the expectations and curiousity of learning subject goes to hell. What the hell they want from a subject like ISCA being introduced in C.A curriculum... They want to give I.T enabled skill set to students, introduce SAP as a compulsory practical measure in course set. But no , they just want students to mug up stuff and write it as it is in exams.

Yes, as I said earlier, there is a lot of emphasis on the examinations. But this even applies to other professional courses . But can the students stop learning the things which they are expected to learn?

I don't there is any dearth of SAP coaching centers in India. After giving your attempt you'll have a good amount of time to attend those coaching centers and learn courses like SAP. If time is a constraint, you can even go for Online Coaching.

I have asked you to visit the campus/see the videos on youtube not for the sake of seeing the Infrastructure,Canteen or College Life. But to know the way B-School students approach a case-study. A lot of CA students clearly lack Critical and Logical Thinking.(Not all the students-Students who are spoon-fed by the coaching institutes. There are many CAs who perform better than IIM grads in Finance sector, so it also depends on the individual). Recruiters are not dumb to pay fat pay cheques to those B-School grads. They will pay a CA Fresher exactly the same if he/she has all the skills required for the job. Every problem doesn't have a simple solution and you don't have to conlude in one go.

Also, don't make lame assumptions . I can judge that by your comment "They want to give I.T enabled skill set to students, introduce SAP as a compulsory practical measure in course set. But no , they just want students to mug up stuff and write it as it is in exams"

Name an accountancy body in the world which gives you SAP coaching?

When you have chosen to do a job, you are supposed to learn all the skills needed. SAP is not mandatory for every job in Accountancy, Tax or Finance.

Hmmm...So if no accounting body introduces SAP as a part of their course than ICAI should also follow same, so if engineers can acquire additional skill sets after their degree (for eg. a mechanical engineers learns .net and php and thereafter gets a job in TCS or Wipro) than why CA students should be an exception, so if engineers are facing oversupply problem than why CA(s) are not enjoying that heat...it is like answering an allegation with a counter allegation

And the best is giving examples from IIM, XLRI, or a person getting 36 lakhs a year or month or this that...Dear all, exceptions are always there. IIM, XLRI or CA qualified enjoying salary of 36 lakhs and all are exceptions. These are not common. And if, even after being a CHARTERED ACCOUNTANT we have to be an exception than I guess............what can I guess you all know this means.....KHODA PAHAR NIKLI CHUHIYA :D

I am not denying the fact that many CA(s) lack critical analysis and thinking but this is also true that CA course is not that lucrative at present as it was in past and acquring new skill sets(apart from accounts/finance) will only degrade it like the engineering profession. Already recruiters are now demanding qualification like "An ideal candidate should be a CA plus CS/CWA". And I am very happy to see some really cool suggestions to make CA course again lucrative like introducing SAP or interaction with other universities etc.