Has CA lost its charm?

@ Neeraj: I have found one more interesting thing : The Company Sushant is talking about is also managed by a CA. I think he talked about evosys. Evosys CEO - Umang Nahata himself is a CA. I dont think he will offer some technical job to a CA, since he understands the skill sets of a CA.

And this company has done a few good projects also.

https://evosys.co.in/management

Shashank

Shashank Sir, it once again validates the credibility of Chartered Accountants as business leaders and managers.. And if I am not wrong, the CAs in the 1960s and 1970s did not engaged too much in the finance profiles, rather they were assurance service providers. And its the CAs of those and later periods, who have made themselves a source of admiration for the generations to follow because of their business management skills and not limiting themselves to finance..

Your valuable opinions??

Originally posted by : Shashank
	Quoting : "They had also told that they will FIX THE MINIMUM SALARY  @ CAMPUS TO BE 9LCPA....What happened?"   The minimum salary to be offered to Fresh CA on Day0 for Delhi and Mumbai Campusus has been alredy increased to 9 Lakhs PA. (Please refer the relevent file uploaded recently in cmii.icai.org)

Fixing the minimum salary of 9lcpa at campus meant that the salaries of ALL the jobs to offered AT campus would have to be at least 9lacs or above; and the division of slots of Day 1 :companies whose CTC>> 9lacs ....means something different.

/forum/ca-salary-proposed-9l-minimum-from-2012-will-it-happen--148810.asp

https://www.business-standard.com/india/news/icai-wants-entry-level-salary-for-cas-raised/429988/

This obviously was just a statement , which all of us know is far from reality. If implemented, the placement statistics will get even more discouraging.

And, Mr Singh, why do you repeatedly try to paint me as an anti-IT guy.............Had i been so anti-IT, i wouldn't have joined an IT company when i had so many other choices. The availability of a new avenue, future prospects of being a SAP professional and many other oppurtunities , prodded me to accept the first offer (my first interview) ever got in my life, by an IT giant. And also being trained in SAP wouldn't hamper my chances of either starting a practice, or being a part of  Systems Auditor's team in a Big4, or going on to become an entrepreneur , with so many opportunities waiting to be tapped, even after 3-4 years experience in SAP.

But, that doesn't mean, all the people recruited have got the profile, work areas as desired, as..............(confidentiality clause).....can't reveal ........................(best thing is to personally ask any CA in non CF role @ IT Co)..........

The reasons why CVs aren't shortlisted in campus is "DEMAND IS LESS THAN SUPPLY". The passouts of MAy2010 for eg were shortlisted and even bagged job , even if they didnt clear all exams in 1 go...... That was because of results of May2010 reflecting the Market wants....The situation isn't the same , currently....So, freshers blaming the parent body is understandable , supply of CAs seems unjustifiable to many. 

The campus also offers a glimpse of the job market outside. If a fresher, despite being shortlisted, doesn't get recruited , then he will have to shoulder majority of the blame. But, if due to inflated results, he doesn't get shortlisted even in one Co, he will be discouraged for sure  and will apply to work in such profiles (fit for BCom passouts from lower ranked univ) for meagre salaries......

Hopefully, the new Council, to be elected this year end, will take concrete steps to counter the landslide in brand value, and take drastic steps to improve placement ratios.

/forum/why-no-news-of-campus-placement-icai-website--199157.asp

Mr. Sushant, I am not painting you as an anti-IT guy, but still if you feel so, I duly apologise. And if you have been shortlisted and recruited in the first instance, doesn't it shows that your profile was appealing to the recruiter.

If we are not getting the desired job profiles owing to recession and economic slowdown, we must display pragmatism while selecting the alternative job profile. And also, it happens that one fresher wants to work in a particular job profile, but he/she does not have the necessary skills to justify himself as a candidate for that profile. So, instead of taking up mediocre assignments, we must choose the alternative assignments that are related to that desired profile and seek for continuous development.

Originally posted by : Shashank
	@ Neeraj: I have found one more interesting thing : The Company Sushant is talking about is also managed by a CA. I think he talked about evosys. Evosys CEO - Umang Nahata himself is a CA. I dont think he will offer some technical job to a CA, since he understands the skill sets of a CA. And this company has done a few good projects also. https://evosys.co.in/management Shashank

Yeah, i had talked about that company, as it had also come to campus. The video showing chaos in Campus was a result of freshers running to submit their resumes when the co declared "open interview". As i had already got selected on Day1 by another Co, i wasn't present on Day2 , and had to rely on the video capture given to me by a friend..........pretty ugly scenes...

My target was FMCG Cos,OMC,Credit Rating cos or Equity Research Cos. ..... I assessed the ground reality about the "requirement of CAs @ corporate india" and that's why i joined an IT Co....Maybe will change sector after getting further skill sets,degrees and work experience.... 

Originally posted by : Sushant Lohani
	My target was FMCG Cos,OMC,Credit Rating cos or Equity Research Cos. ..... I assessed the ground reality about the "requirement of CAs @ corporate india" and that's why i joined an IT Co....Maybe will change sector after getting further skill sets,degrees and work experience....

This is what had been consistently highlighted through the last few posts, that if the times are turbulent, pursue the next best alternative based on assessment of your skills and shift gears when the opportunity comes to you..

Thankfully sir, we are now echoing opinions

Well, i still stick to my view on what the topic of this forum is based on........."Has CA course lost its charm"..... for the moment, yes, obviously.....It all started with May2011 results and now-a-days , even getting a rank (which many do by skipping articleship and rot-learning) isn't enough.....

Someone, also was talking about some rankers getting 13lac + CTC....but there were also many rankers who couldn't even clear "Written Test" which a simple person like me could clear during CP.

I would like to draw your attention toward the salary of Olam International which had offered CTC of 70lcpa in March 2010 or 2011(correct me) and our ICAI had been in news with headlines like (CA bags 70lac salary).........but the same Co came this time, with package of Rs25 lac......

https://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2010-03-06/news/27614623_1_chartered-accountants-campus-recruitment-salary

We all should ponder over why the sudden steep decrease in Salary offered? Is it because of recession? I dont think so....The salaries by the same Co to IIM passouts hasn't decreased...

The answer could be revolving around the "quality of passouts" rather than "quantity".

If one is getting rank by doing dummy, then its not the "PROFESSION" that is at fault, rather its the "PROFESSIONAL" who is at fault and the one who is bringing disrepute to the "PROFESSION".. how fat your wallet will go will depend on how skilled you are. If someone got 70 lac CTC (in 2010) then it was the skills that took him to those figures and not just the rank or the numbers. Had it been the case of mere rank, then we would have not been talking about rankholders being jobless or otherwise underperforming.. Rank will only make you favouriate for the interview, not for the job..

As mentioned about the fall in salary offered, I feel that it has something to do with the level/position for which the hiring is done..Also, there may be other factors like prior experience and other qualifications. We can only speculate that why the decline in salary was, but the fact remains known to only those who are concerned with that.

Exactly, its the "quality of passouts" that holds the key, and this is what has been conveyed clearly by othrs and me in their posts.

@ Sushant:

Please see the groud reality for offering different packages by the same company in different campus programs. It is not because they are trying to reduce the package. In the campus in which 70 Lakhs package was offered the posting was given in Nigeria, which is a underdeveloped country. The company has to spend huge amount on Accomodation and security. Every employee is given personal security, personal car with driver and accomodation because of the situation in the country. I have not heard of any bad incident with any employee there, but the comapnies deem it necessary to provide these facilities. Moreover, a very small number of candidates is ready to move outside india, beacuse there is misconception amongst the Indian candidates that once you work outside India, your skills in Accounting/ Taxation/ Auditing detoriate. So companies normally spend more for candidates in these countries. and actually these countries are most profitable for these companies in absence of any competition.

The package of 25 lakhs was offered for posting in Southeast asia, which is the best market to work for and there is big inflow of Indian professionals in these countries. There the companies do not feel any difficulty in filling a position beacause of easy availability of candidates.

So it is not right to say that since a company is offering lesser package in any campus then it means the value of a CA has gone down.

Shashank

Originally posted by : Shashank
	@ Sushant: Please see the groud reality for offering different packages by the same company in different campus programs. It is not because they are trying to reduce the package. In the campus in which 70 Lakhs package was offered the posting was given in Nigeria, which is a underdeveloped country. The company has to spend huge amount on Accomodation and security. Every employee is given personal security, personal car with driver and accomodation because of the situation in the country. I have not heard of any bad incident with any employee there, but the comapnies deem it necessary to provide these facilities. Moreover, a very small number of candidates is ready to move outside india, beacuse there is misconception amongst the Indian candidates that once you work outside India, your skills in Accounting/ Taxation/ Auditing detoriate. So companies normally spend more for candidates in these countries. and actually these countries are most profitable for these companies in absence of any competition. The package of 25 lakhs was offered for posting in Southeast asia, which is the best market to work for and there is big inflow of Indian professionals in these countries. There the companies do not feel any difficulty in filling a position beacause of easy availability of candidates. So it is not right to say that since a company is offering lesser package in any campus then it means the value of a CA has gone down. Shashank

The reason you are given could be one of the reason...ie the Job Location.... I have emailed some of my contacts in that Co if that is really the case.... But as far as i know, i don't think Accomodation and Security will comprise of 65pc of one's CTC....Maybe, Indian CAs are valued so much there, that we are provided Navy SEALs as our bodyguards (to explain the high costs)...LOL...

Jokes apart,as I too had applied to as many openings as possible, i also came to know one thing.. We used to see emails from many Agencies/Manpower Cos that "Job opening for Accountant at falanaa African Country".... Even in some reputed papers of Ahmedabad....I came to know the reason behind some of the genuine ads (there were job offerings for real).... It was not that they needed a CA to keep their accounts... The hirers were NRI who owned some SMEs there; but they didn't trust Africans there. They have a belief that Indian accountants (not necessarily a CA) is less likely to backstabb them or fleece them....We can probe all the angles.
 

Yes sushant .. you are right CA IS LOOSING ITS CHARM...

the passouts of may 2011 nov 2011 and now freshly qualifieds of may 2012 as well .. are being treated as dummy passouts

reason being ... demand is 1 .. supply is 4

i dont agree with niraj singh at all ... dude my solid advise ... please qualify first ... as u dnt knwwat the situation is ... dont solely go based on the statements made by officials of our respected institutes or coachings masters .. i knw people who did decent articleshio with ranks in ca inter and finals as well .. sitting idle at home

about mr. shashank .. brother .. wat to say ... i feel bad to express my views saying that .. the designation which i am using .. for which i ve toiled and workd really hard ... cleared in first attempt as well .. with regular articleship and all extra things which one ca student does .. it could not fetch me a good job ... reason ? there arent sufficient jobs in market 

i dont agree with you hat there are good openings in job sites ... most of ( around 90% are from consultants ) ...

you both know wat ? Only those people who have qualirfied in these 3 attempts can understand this pain ...

rest will spread their Gyaan which they have ...

Mr. shashank .. i do agree this is the best profession in the country for the commerce 

i do respect  it as well .. but the question here is of its charm ..

wat u think .. passing studetns like ... 25% ( on average basis) is a good decesion ?

u know wat .. who so ever could not qualify before may2010.. have now qualfied ( most of them)

so wat u feel ... is that 17 lacs job is being offered to them ?

your company may be the exception .. but dont judge it as reality ....

those who are spreading Gyaan above blaming the articleship and other parts of ones personality ...

Sushant is recruited by one of the best IT co. in country that too in that campus where the ratio of recruitment was very poor...

so one cant question if he is eligible or not and what he is saying is incorrect

i feel very sad smtimes when my frds ( almost everyone ) asks me " bhai koi opening ho to bata dena please .. 3 mths ho gaye ... "

wat to reply to him/ her who is a 1st attempt clearer and begging for jobs now.

wat wud u say .. ?

is that sufficient mr,. gentle men ? that we are adhering to WTO and hav to produce more and more.

i conclude saying that 

kindly go into the freshers mind and realise ... hw much he has borne to aquire that degree .. and in return what he is getting ... instead of questioning one genuine guy who is himself employed but is worry for his profession.

Long live ICAI long live its reputation.

Peace Out

I don't want to argue anymore. I just know one thing that talent is something which sets you apart. Also, it is on you how much value you give to your profession. There are people who want a CA to work in 12,000 rupees per month. Its on your will whether you are impatient enough to grab that offer or look for better options.

Shashank

Mr. Ravi, I haven't gone for any coaching, so I don't know what the coaching teachers say.. Whatever I have said is solely based on what I have read in Journals and my own little bit of research which I have already clarified earlier. Somewhere around late May or early June, I read that 58% of the employers feel that there is no employable talent available despite the availaibility of jobs..Finance was also one of those areas in which adequate employable talent was not available.. and also it has been highlighted many times that "In India there are employment opportunities but there are not employable people".  Having said that, no candidate says that I am not good, not employable, its only the employers who think otherwise (no personal targets with this very statement)..

As far as finding jobs on job sites is concerned, I don't think that merely creating a profile will help you out.  Its essential to get yourself identified to few leading job consultants (ABC Consultants, teamlease, globalhunt, randstad etc. to name a few) and opt for paid services..

Mr. Shashank, I totally agree with you on your last post. If we will continue accepting job profiles that are mediocre or are paltry paid, we cannot think of better prospects for us in the future. And also, by doing that, we will be hurting reputations of  future Chartered Accountants (including me).

To conclude, the senior members are expected to guide the junior ones about how to tackle the scenario.. But unfortunately, its only the blame game that is being played.

@ Neeraj: I also didnot go for any coaching in any subject. So I also don't know about the teachers.