English Does matter,so do analytical skills but EQ is better

Page no : 5

Priyanka Gupta (Articl tranee) (24 Points)
Replied 16 March 2010

Originally posted by : Saikat Saha




Originally posted by : Priyanka Gupta






AS WE KNOW THAT COUNTRY RULES AND LAW ARE FIRST,  IN INDIA HINDI IS NATIONAL language.

 

IT IS RESPONCIBLITY AND DUTY OF US THAT WE SHOULD LERN HINDI, AND WHERE POSSIBLE WE SHOULD TALK IN HINDI, DONT USE ENGLISH UNNESSESERY.

 






Mind u Priyanka , Dont write n profess wrong information -- HINDI IS NOT THE NATIONAL LANGUAGE OF INDIA , back ur arguements with proper info n not vague terms okay ...For better understanding refer to this judgement by Hon. Gujarat Highcourt 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Theres-no-national-language-in-India-Gujarat-High-Court/articleshow/5496231.cms

Regards

Saikat S.

 u say this kyonki u are oriya learn hindi leave oriya...hindi rashtrabhasha...dont be desh drohi...


Saikat Saha (CA PCC -CS Professional Student)   (347 Points)
Replied 17 March 2010

Originally posted by : Priyanka Gupta




Originally posted by : Saikat Saha









Originally posted by : Priyanka Gupta






AS WE KNOW THAT COUNTRY RULES AND LAW ARE FIRST,  IN INDIA HINDI IS NATIONAL language.

 

IT IS RESPONCIBLITY AND DUTY OF US THAT WE SHOULD LERN HINDI, AND WHERE POSSIBLE WE SHOULD TALK IN HINDI, DONT USE ENGLISH UNNESSESERY.

 






Mind u Priyanka , Dont write n profess wrong information -- HINDI IS NOT THE NATIONAL LANGUAGE OF INDIA , back ur arguements with proper info n not vague terms okay ...For better understanding refer to this judgement by Hon. Gujarat Highcourt 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Theres-no-national-language-in-India-Gujarat-High-Court/articleshow/5496231.cms

Regards

Saikat S.






 u say this kyonki u are oriya learn hindi leave oriya...hindi rashtrabhasha...dont be desh drohi...

See Priyanka i dont want to malign the dignity of this forum ,so m not hurling any abuse against u but would u retain the dignity of this forum by removing this term "desh drohi" ...u r n absolute nonsense girl i ve ever interacted with in my life not gal xctly person would rather suit it.

MY request to other forum members n Priyanka also to plz relate Hindi rashtrabhasha learning to Deshdrohita ...just how sick a person can get ....our constitution guarntees freedom of language also if u know priyanka n only for people like u n u only regionalism has deepened its rootes in our beloved motherland.

As i put in Hindi u r a "kuen ka mendak " u dont even know to distinguish persons by their communities , just by seeing my title as "Saha" u have remarked me as an oriya as u dont know that "saha" surname is used extensively in Bengal,Assam n Northeast....U have left with a very bad taste in my mouth by this faltu comment....N i can read write speak in English,Assamese,Bengali, n Hindi also...Samajh mein aaya

Go get some life priyanka....


Kaustubh (Analyst) (43 Points)
Replied 17 March 2010

Hi Mythreya,

I dont fully agree with your view for the following reasons.........

1. Language is just a medium of communication. The underlying message is of utmost importance. We first need to master out domain knowledge / core skills ...language is secondary.

2. We were ruled by the British, so we learnt English. Had we been ruled by Spanish,Dutch or French, we would have hardly learnt English. I donot deny that English is a popular language, but at the same time there are so many countries which speak French / German / Spanish... For eg these are the languages very popular in South America, Africa apart from Europe.

3. Just to cite one example...I have worked in two MNC's.. I have seen people at the top most hierarchy not knowing English / not at all fluent in English...But still these guys are at the top because of their domain knowledge / skills.......

4. Take example of Japan. They are leaders in automobiles / engineering and many other industries...Their CEO's can hardly speak english........

 

 

 


CA Ravi Sisodia (CA,CS,CMA) (32226 Points)
Replied 17 March 2010

 

Originally posted by : Mythreya
Dear Raviji,
When you oppose a point of view,you must explain why you oppose it.
This is proper "Communication"
You had written elsewhere that "Hardwork,concentration,etc" are important for success.
But you miss the point inasmuchthat all these traits are a product of Emotional intelligence.
Only an emotionally intelligent person can be motivated to put in hardwork and made to concentrate.
Everything has its roots in Emotional intelligence.
If you want to oppose my views just for the sake of looking different and for the sake of argument,then I have no comments to proffer.I only help people and discuss views when the person is willing to listen and open-minded about things,not when one already knows certain things and yet behaves in yet another fashion.
If I have said anything wrong,please do forgive me.
Best wishes,
Mythreya
P.S.Voltaire said(as is commonly ascribed): "I might not agree with what you are saying but I  will support till my last breath your right to say it!"
P.S.S.So, yeah, you can say anything against my views too.(But if you want to make it impactive,try to communicate better and support your stated view(or anti-view) with sane arguments)

 

Dear Friends,

Communication is the only way to make understand every one commonly but it is not necessary that you should use only English Language for communication.If you want to achieve success then nothing is impossible.The only thing is that you should have practical knowledge & Experience.At present why other countries gives jobs to Indians eventhough they are not excellent in English because they know that Indians possesses knowledge & experience.Asked one question to all successful persons who are working abroad whether they were perfect in speaking English when they cleared their CA exams? Asked one question to all big industrialist when they started their businesses were fluent in speaking English? If we want to get success whether we are MBA from B-School or CA only Hardwork, honesty, dedication and thinking power are the keys of success.


Mythreya (Finance IT & Accounting)   (2183 Points)
Replied 17 March 2010

Originally posted by : Kaustubh

Hi Mythreya,

I dont fully agree with your view for the following reasons.........

1. Language is just a medium of communication. The underlying message is of utmost importance. We first need to master out domain knowledge / core skills ...language is secondary.

2. We were ruled by the British, so we learnt English. Had we been ruled by Spanish,Dutch or French, we would have hardly learnt English. I donot deny that English is a popular language, but at the same time there are so many countries which speak French / German / Spanish... For eg these are the languages very popular in South America, Africa apart from Europe.

3. Just to cite one example...I have worked in two MNC's.. I have seen people at the top most hierarchy not knowing English / not at all fluent in English...But still these guys are at the top because of their domain knowledge / skills.......

4. Take example of Japan. They are leaders in automobiles / engineering and many other industries...Their CEO's can hardly speak english........

 

 

 

 

 1.If language is just a medium and the underlying message only needs to be communicated in a languageless language-->You must be either a great messiah or a silent Avatar like Buddha to command such Charisma and respect.Even they  used to give lengthy sermons(Budha's sermons are the foundation stones for Dhammapada) and talk in parables and stories of beauty(Jesus used to  frequently talk in parables to emphasize a point.)

A person who is equal to you in analytical skills,domain knowledge and core skills but differentiates from you by way of language inasmucas speaking very good language and  ALSO has tremendous communication skills(bedrock being a command over language and fluency;though one might argue that Communication is beyond language) would be million times in a better position to over-take you easily.Your top management wont say,"Look Kaustubh is weak in language and communication but his core skills are great and this other person in good in both,yet we should give a chance to the underdog,Kausthub and not the other person,so lets shoot for Kausthub...AYE AYE!"...*Sigh*..all these good things I wish for you to happen...Unfortunately, all these happen in Movies not real life!

The saying "Communication is beyond language" is all good to hear.But practically if you start a presentation like this:

The company A does this and that and this and that....blah blah blah...all you are doing is despite your 'domain knowledge' and core skills is put your audience to sleep....ZZZZZZZZ-Mode!

Whereas someone who has good fluency and a command over language,starts off with aplomb and style(first impression makes the audience sit up and notice),tells parables/anecdotes,some jokes,etc at the same time displays his analytical skills, will make the audience go Ga-Ga about him.(Normally people dont have the guts to crack a joke in a 'serious' presentation but this is what majorly differentiates good speakers from average speakers--the ability to intersperse humour into speech.)All this come from a good command of language easily.I accept all these traits can come about without language too.You can crack a joke or tell a story using mime-language,I accept this or Broken English, Agreed! I accept that and even more but then all I say,it comes easily with a good command over language.

There is a difference between a cricketer working out in the streets and becoming a great cricketer and someone who undergoes proper training,good diet,exercise-regimen,etc and becoming a great cricketer.Many take Sachin's example of playing street cricket and becoming a legend.

Many dont know that he became great only after he implemented serious net-sessions,regimented exrcises schedule,proper care for diet.Yes,there was some Raw-skill without which no one would find place in the Indian International Cricket Team.But then how the 'rawness' is professionally honed is yet another issue.

Romance is onething,practicality in real-world is different.

Its great... very very inspiring to hear Rags-to-riches stories.Even I accept that and it is also very humbling for people at the top.It gives me a proof of God's existence but though such stories  are there they don't happen often.Often it is the person who is open-minded and willing to learn the language(of success not merely English or some working language) who will win.

2. These days even Chinese are aggressively teaching their current generation very good English(not Chinaman english).Days are changing,my friend.There are many 'if-onlys' in life but then I see only what is currently relevant.I do not want to go intoa revierie what would have been the case if India was ruled by Spaniards completely...what would have been the case if I had 100 crore rupees?...What would have been the case if I were to buy some property in future in moon...this is not possibility thinking...this is mere wishful thinking.

Statistically English dominates the world.Even countries where Spanish,French,German,etc are being spoken are taking pro-active steps to augment their English skills.And English being a workable and simple business language,is being fast adopted.We Indians despite having a rich heritage of English are shying away from this due to regionalism and factionism(and also political rhetoric by cunning politicians).

English is  very relevant in uniting India and also a workable language for Business world.

My personal preference is for Sanskrit(samskruthaa) but then if I tell..."It would have been fantastic if the whole world speaks Sanskrit."..it is being very naiive,immature and wishful on my part.So, should I then cry hoarse about this thing? or adopt English as a tool,learn Sanskrit which remains my passion(and so is Chinese) and remain culturally active?

Again,Romance and wishful thinking is good but practicality in business world is another thing.A CA sees(rather, should see) first practicality more and not seep into wishful-imaginations of the capricious mind.

There are countries which go-by without English,I admit that.Japan.SouthKorea,etc,some countries in SouthAmerica.

But look at their gross income,business being done,etc(Especially of South America and Africa).

Statistics not always lies.

3. To reach to the top something of a different calibre is required.I accept it is not mere language skills or communication.Something more,something of a chutzpah,something of a killer-instinct,etc are needed.A greater amount of EQ is needed.My thread starts with that topic as in: EQ is the best among the three.I NEVER learn English and go to the top-management.I would be a distilled idiot if I say such things....These people whom you mention have good EQ.It has nothing to do anything with language skills.Maybe with better language skills they might even more higher than they are now.

Also, exceptions do not make the rule.For every one exception you show me,I show you 3 people who fit my bill of having both language skills and analytical skills/domainknowledge/core skills.

These days,you cannot afford to neglect anything and yet aspire to grow in career.People who are smarter than you,who have core-skills and also have fantastic communication and language skills,will by-pass you and go ahead.

One can play cricket and hit a sixer and also grab maximum runs with an empty stomach,not exercising or following an erratic dietary plan just based on purely my raw  cricketing skills.Yes, it is possible.Proverbial flaashes in the frying pan are but occasional.

However, a person who is practicing at the nets,takes care of his diet,follows a regimented exercise plan has a better chance of scoring those runs,playing fit and more importantly consistently win after win,match after match.

4. Anyone who supports linguistic-regionalism quote Japan(or Korea) and no other country.

Japan's philosophy is different it has nothing to do with language but more to do with a working philosophy and culture which every Japanese(or atleast 99% Japanese!) have.They are secretive by nature,friendly but secretive;hospitable but secretive(my sister worked in Japan as a genetic scientist for  6 years and she used to tell me lot of stories) hardworking by nature,work in teams by nature.Their lives revolves around work work and work and nothing else much.(Romance is lost in such lifestyles--Japan has one of the highest suicidal rates,mind you!)

Japan's philosphy be it Kaizen or Zen or their work ethics,is fantastic.They work as Teams,they have a great work culture.

It is a  product  of this that makes them World leader in business and not merely a blind adherence to their language.Now, whether they have EQ is something totally different.

If we have all this, we too can discard English and adopt Bhojpuri or Konkani or Telugu or Malayalam or Bhil tribe language(if they have a codified language ie) and succeed.

The problem is we dont have that.

We just merely engage in verbal clap-traps about language,caste and religion and dont really work towards any REAL development.

That is the problem!

Bhaasha ek samasya nahin hain. Bhaasha ke peche' joh bhaavana Chupi hain woh bahuth badi samasya hain!

(Language is not a problem,but the emotions which lie hidden beneath the language (by those speaking it) this becomes a big problem).

FYI, Japanese too are learning English in a big way these days.You would be really rich if you go as an English teacher and work in Japan.You would be lapped up instantly.Such is the craze for English.

Japanese CEOS can hardly speak English but they are working hard at it to learn the language and not engage in mere verbal rhetorics about their language.

Adapt and be flexible or perish,this is today's norm.

------------

Aside:

How am I able to effectively clarify whats in my mind? It is because of this language called English.I weild a unique power wherever Im and many times my language skills have saved my skin,got me many many friends worldwide,gave me really enriching experiences.

I consider it as a tool in my hands without any emotional strings.

And if you consider the Angrezi as your sworn enemy(I dont consider anyone my enemy): Then too I have a snippet to end this discussion:To use the 'enemy's' weapons against him is the mind of  thegreatest strategist--Sun Tzu in Art of War.

Also, improving English just needs 15 minutes daily(its also fun to learn)...in 3 to 4 years your skills increase considerably.You would be amazed,really really amazed at your new gotten power.

Best wishes,

Mythreya.

1 Like


Mythreya (Finance IT & Accounting)   (2183 Points)
Replied 18 March 2010

Originally posted by : CA Ravi sisodia , ACA. LCS.

 




Originally posted by : Mythreya





Dear Raviji,
When you oppose a point of view,you must explain why you oppose it.
This is proper "Communication"
You had written elsewhere that "Hardwork,concentration,etc" are important for success.
But you miss the point inasmuchthat all these traits are a product of Emotional intelligence.
Only an emotionally intelligent person can be motivated to put in hardwork and made to concentrate.
Everything has its roots in Emotional intelligence.
If you want to oppose my views just for the sake of looking different and for the sake of argument,then I have no comments to proffer.I only help people and discuss views when the person is willing to listen and open-minded about things,not when one already knows certain things and yet behaves in yet another fashion.
If I have said anything wrong,please do forgive me.
Best wishes,
Mythreya
P.S.Voltaire said(as is commonly ascribed): "I might not agree with what you are saying but I  will support till my last breath your right to say it!"
P.S.S.So, yeah, you can say anything against my views too.(But if you want to make it impactive,try to communicate better and support your stated view(or anti-view) with sane arguments)






 

Dear Friends,

Communication is the only way to make understand every one commonly but it is not necessary that you should use only English Language for communication.If you want to achieve success then nothing is impossible.The only thing is that you should have practical knowledge & Experience.At present why other countries gives jobs to Indians eventhough they are not excellent in English because they know that Indians possesses knowledge & experience.Asked one question to all successful persons who are working abroad whether they were perfect in speaking English when they cleared their CA exams? Asked one question to all big industrialist when they started their businesses were fluent in speaking English? If we want to get success whether we are MBA from B-School or CA only Hardwork, honesty, dedication and thinking power are the keys of success.

 

Raviji,

Thankyou for your well-thoughout reply.Thankyou for taking your precious time to answer me. 

Ok good for a start now You have given me some coherent arguments to favour your stance and now I understand what is really in your mind through this crutch called English with which you ahve expalined me your stance.

Mind you,Coherence being from your view-point.This you have done it by expressing yourself after my goading than a mere..."I dont agree with you."

For this you have,I repeat, used the English language to communicate it to me.

On this note,let me start my views on this counter.

All this is in a healthy discussion way not debates or arguments to prove who is superior.

You are Right and Iam also Right.So,never take anything I tell to heart.I respect your experience,knowledge and qualifications.Please entertain no doubts about this.

This is all for future students and if you are open-minded about my pure intentions for you too

---------------------------------------------------------------

Practical knowledge and experience: How do you gain these? In a white collar job like CA?

You obviously are not working as an ironsmith to learn the skill watching an ironsmith at work and apprenticing under him.(These days even Ironsmiths(blacksmiths) make a bee-line to Toastmasters international(an organization which teaches all these communication skills and language also) to improve their businesses and to talk effec tively to their customers).

You gain this experience by passing the exams,reading the books,learning from few other books.Im sure you would not be referring Hindi or some other vernacular language and reading advanced concepts like derivates or corporate law advanced nuances.If in future such books are published then too I dont know how many actually read it from such laborious texts.

You have gained all this by consistent exercise of whatever english language skills you have/had.

Practical knowledge and experience does not fall from heaven as a manna.

It is closely linked to language.It is not language,I admit but yet closely linked to language.Try to think in mere figures and abstract images the Balance sheet and profit and loss account.You cannot.You need the proper of words atleast in a miniscule fashion.

----so then,you might argue: "Ok I admit, so I just need a miniscule portion/skills in English why bother my head with trying to improve my english grammar and skills?"

I will come to this in a bit...

--------------------

Many Indians living abroad(including me) have developed greater English skills for survival.

Language skill is not something stagnant.I might not be speaking the same English which I spoke in my school(PSBB) say during the tenth,now I speak with a distinct Canadian accent(maybe interspersed with a few Americanisms)

Language changes people,people change language as they go.

So, the question..."Where those who were speaking English while they were doing CA ...blah blah visavis now...blah blah..." would not hold much water.

---------

Indians who live abroad are good in English to a working extent atleast.I have seen this extensively.There are a few black sheep and they lead lives accordingly.

Many are mere programmers where language is not of a great concern.

However, even these programmers when they try to go to CIO levels(CIO=Chief Information Officer) then they need to have good language skills and communicative abilities.

Students who leave Indian soil have to clear TOEFL/GRE/GMAT....All this gives some command some skills(not great to make them shakespeare) over English.

Then these people with greater expsoure to the language there,evolve.

A person who evolves and grows adopts new habits,embraces new things and not stuck with old things.There is nothing embarassing about it or any sense of betrayal.

Most of these talks come by people who feel insecure about their language skills,who do not want to listen,understand and evolve.

--------

Ambani when he started out did not know much English...yeah,Accepted point taken...but then he did not stay put like that.He was a self-learnt man.He learnt English most punctilliously.He garnered more contracts talking the talk,walking the walk in English.He did not become Shakspeaere neither did he remain a dud in English to need an interpreter to translate the language into Hindi/Rajasthani for him.He grew,he evolved...

Many out there do that.

Again, one would be tempted to quote Sony,Toyota,Samsung,etc and their CEOs and these are Japanese or Korean cultures and it is more to do with their culture as pointed out earlier.Also these companies have very well trained high-language skills categories in the top echelon in USA where their major business is.

--------------------------

Hardwork,honesty,dedication and thinkingpower all need a base and bedrock of good language skills to learn and evolve.But these are all EQ skills and that I put it even greater than Language or English,thus here we both meet.

Cheers!

Please do not take anything to heart.It was not meant as a 'counter' or a 'retort' but as an elucidation for those who want to learn the language better.You may continue your tried path as before,the choice is yours.

Best wishes,

Mythreya

1 Like


(Guest)

awesome Mythreya sir! just awesome...you have explained very very beautifully..i bow to you...you are helpng students like me...u are boon to our caclubindia...


Priyanka Gupta (Articl tranee) (232 Points)
Replied 18 March 2010

www.youtube.com/results

 

 

Please cilck on link and watch all videos.


Priyanka Gupta (Articl tranee) (24 Points)
Replied 18 March 2010

indiamust have hindi as only language else peopl like u veer,saikat must get out of country...u all deshdrohi says babaramdev see video...mythreya u alsoget out of country...mera bharath...all spoutindians like u ionly...

1 Like


(Guest)
Originally posted by : Priyanka Gupta

indiamust have hindi as only language else peopl like u veer,saikat must get out of country...u all deshdrohi says babaramdev see video...mythreya u alsoget out of country...mera bharath...all spoutindians like u ionly...

 wtf...i will kick u if u talk like this...in this forum...have u done one useful thing other than give such messages...see urself in mirror...chal futt...

1 Like



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